Dulfy Reborn

an archive of dulfy.net for Guild Wars 2

Vale Guardian Raid Boss Guide

By Dulfy , Published on Fri 20 November 2015
Guides / Raids

A guide to GW2 Vale Guardian, the first raid boss of Spirit Vale.

General Information

Gearing and Preparation

There are some debates on if full Ascended gear if needed for the first boss. At a minimum you should have Ascended trinkets and weapons as they give a bigger bonus than exotics compared to armor. Raids are currently fairly challenging content where 1-2 seconds can make the difference between a kill and a wipe. You need to have a min/maxing mentality where you do everything you can to pull your weight.

Party Composition

Disclaimer: I want to preface this section by saying that there is no universal optimal composition. This is simply what worked for us and may be different for you. Do not read this at face value and think this is the meta or other classes are incapable of doing it. Vale Guardian doesn’t have a very tight DPS check so you can really bring whatever you want as long you ensure there is sufficient healing, alacrity, quickness, fury and might stacks.

What I posted below is a party composition we came up with that we decided was optimal for us. It is not for every raid group.

In general the party composition is 1 Healer, 1 Tank, 1 Chronomancer, 1 Warrior, 2 Heralds, 3 Condition damage dealers, and fill the rest with whatever Power DPS

Our exact comp in the kill video was the following.

Consumables

Pre-fight assignment

You need to have a ranged party of 5 players whose job is run to the green circles as soon as they spawn. Druid, Chronomancer, and condition ranged classes are great for this.

Additionally, you need to have a party of 3 condition damage dealers to go to the Red Guardian when the split phase happens at 66% and 33%.

Timers

Raid Mechanics

The fight is divided into 5 phases. Two of the phases are split phases which occur at 66% and 33%. Vale Guardian has 22 million HP and an enrage timer of 8 minutes.

Videos

Druid PoV

Phase 1

This phase will last until the boss reach 66%. With good DPS you can finish this phase around or under a minute.

Positioning

The Vale Guardian fight area is a circular area divided into 3 equal sectors, each with a different colored pylon in the middle (Red, Green and Blue).

gw2-vale-guardian-guide-2

At start of the fight the tank should drag the boss to a pylon next to the Speed Mushrooms and keep him stationary to ensure max DPS. Do not attack the boss until the tank has him positioned properly as initiating combat will start the timer. Tank can avoid the teleporting blue circle circles by dodging 1 second after they appear back into the pylon wall. We used the blue pylon here for easy split in phase 2. Melee DPS can use weave in every 15 seconds to pick up the Speed Mushrooms buff which also increase your attack speed by 10%.

gw2-vale-guardian-guide

The boss does have a cleave melee attack so you will want to face him away from the raid. However, he does turn when he spawns the blue teleporting circles but he will not cleave the raid so there is nothing for the melee to fear. The arrow undernearth him will show you which area he is facing.

Red Seeker Orbs

Three red seeker orbs spawn every 20s directly next to each of the color pylons. Their goal is to move towards the players and deal significant damage to them. They are immune to blind but you can use immobilize or knockback to push them away. This is especially important when they migrate towards players standing in the green circles

gw2-vale-guardian-guide-3

Blue Teleporting Circles

These blue circles spawn every 9 seconds usually within melee range of the Vale Guardian. They last for about 2 seconds and then they will explode, dealing damage and teleporting anyone caught in them to a random location. Dodges/blocks/evades all work against them and usually you have enough time to simply sidestep away from them. They can become problematic if they spawn within green circles and teleport players out of it.

gw2-vale-guardian-guide-5

Green Circles

These green circles spawn every 15s in a random location in the same sector as the boss. The circle could be close to the boss or far away but it is always in the same sector. You have about 5 seconds to get 4 players into them to negate a raidwide damage. Each player standing inside the circle will reduce 25% of the raidwide damage. There is an inner green circle with a lightning orb on top that get smaller and smaller and before it become a lightning flash. If you don’t have 4 players standing in the the green circle when this lightning flash happens, your raid will take damage. Downed players do not count so if you have 4 players and one of them gets downed while standing inside the circle, your raid will still take the damage. Even with 3 players standing inside the circle, the raid wide damage is enough to down anyone not in full HP and can cause an unrecoverable mess.

gw2-vale-guardian-guide-6 gw2-vale-guardian-guide-7

This green circle is usually the number one reason for raid wipes. While simple mechanically, the green circle could spawn in a far away location, or players standing in them could get teleported by the blue circles or get downed by red seeker orbs. Therefore it is very important to use your knockbacks if you see the seeker robs approaching to keep them away from the green circle. You need to assign a ranged team of 5 players whose job is solely to run into the green circles as soon as they see it spawn and someone on voice comms will need to call them out when they spawn.

Phase 2 (Split)

Phase 2 triggers once the boss is at 66% HP. Depending on your raid’s DPS this could be anywhere from 7 minutes to 6 minutes left on the timer. The Vale Guardian will become immune to damage and run to the middle before disappearing. You will see lightning beams connecting him to the three pylons during this phase transition.

gw2-vale-guardian-guide-8

Guardian Assignment

You should have decided pre-fight which members of your raid team are going to each guardian. For the red guardian you will need 3 condition damage dealers. Only tank need to go to the green guardian while the rest of the raid can stay at the blue guardian. You only have a few seconds to get into the right colored section to get the attunement buff. Once you get this attunement buff, you will receive massive damage if you are inside the red circle of a different colored guardian unless your guardian has being killed. Therefore, you must stay by your assigned color guardian at all times unless otherwise instructed.

gw2-vale-guardian-guide-9

Blue Guardian

For Blue Guardian there are two key mechanics: boon strip and green circle.The green circle mechanic is identical as the one in the first phase but you only need 3 people inside the green circle. The green circle in this phase will spawn pretty close to the Blue Guardian so you should have no problem getting into it in time. For boon strip, the Blue Guardian gains a buff that make him immune to damage every 10 seconds. You will need to remove this via boon strip. Chronomancer sword autoattack will do this job but Revenants can also boon strip in Mallyx.

gw2-vale-guardian-guide-10

Once the Blue Guardian is at 0 health, he will gain a breakbar that you will need to remove in order to finish him off. Do not waste your big crowd control abilities here as you will need them later in Phase 3. If you run two Revenants, one of them can use their Sword 5/Axe 5 and then Staff 5 to fully break it.

Green Guardian

Initially Green Guardian will be tanked by the tank at the green pylon. Once the Blue Guardian has being defeated, the tank should drag the Green Guardian to the sector intersection between green and blue so that the Blue Guardian team can deal damage to it. The Blue Guardian team will take a bit of damage from the blue orbs since they are standing inside Green Guardian’s AoE zone but the damage is healable so Druids should save their Celestial Avatar form for this. The Green Guardian’s special attack is the blue teleporting circles so make sure you keep an eye out for them. If you have good DPS you should only see 1-2 blue teleporting circle attacks at the most. Like the Blue Guardian, there will be a breakbar to break at end of the fight. You other Revenant should be able to handle it.

gw2-vale-guardian-guide-11

Red Guardian

Red Guardian is condition team’s job. Ideally you will want to have three condition damage dealers on this team to ensure a painless and speedy kill. The Red Guardian can be only damaged by condition damage so power DPS are useless here. Watch out for the Seeker Orbs and once the breakbar is up have one Engineer drop a Supply Crate stun and others use Flamethrower 3 and Big ol’ Bomb to finish off the bar. With three condition damagers, Red Guardian should die about the same time as the Green Guardian. If you somehow finish early, prepare for the Vale Guardian but do not help Green Guardian team unless they need it.

Phase 3

Phase 3 lasts from 66% to 33%. It will have the same mechanics as Phase 1 with two new mechanic additions. Due to the movement in this phase, warriors are advised to drop their banners in the middle of the circular room.

Sector AoE

Starting with the Green Sector and rotating clockwise, a sector of the room will be covered in AoE for 20s at a time. The rotation will be Green –> Blue –> Red. While this sector is covered in AoE, anyone traversing through it will take significant damage and can be downed if they are not at full health. Need less to say if you get teleported by a blue teleporting circle, you will have a bad time as there is a chance that you will get ported to an AoE covered sector.

gw2-vale-guardian-guide-12

Tank should start the boss at the Red Sector and then drag him clockwise to the next sector as soon as possible. You basically want to kite the boss to the intersection with the next sector and drag him into the next sector with 3 seconds before the sector AoE change. The number 1 reason for wipes in Phase 3 and 5 is because the tank does not drag the boss fast enough to the next sector. If this happens, the green circle can spawn in the previous sector where the AoE occupies and your raid team can get downed trying to get to it, resulting in a raid wipe.

gw2-vale-guardian-guide-13

Raidwide AoE

This is the second new mechanic for Phase 3. Every 30s, the boss will stop and gain a breakbar. While this breakbar is active, the boss will constantly spam AoE orbs at the raid. The melee DPS must save their big crowd control cooldowns for this and destroy this breakbar as soon as it appears (basically within 1-2s). Headbutts and Wild Blow from Warrior, Staff #5/Sword #5/Axe #5 from Revenant are great for this. Engineer Slick Shoes can also take off most of the bar. You cannot count on the ranged team to do this as the timing for this breakbar often sync up with the timing for green circles and they may not be in a position to help you break this bar.

gw2-vale-guardian-guide-14

What can really screw your team over is if the breakbar happens right before an AoE sector transition. If do not break the bar fast enough, the Vale Guardian will not move and will spawn the green circle inside the current sector which will be covered with AoE.

Phase 4 (Split)

Phase 4 is identical to Phase 2 split. You should arrive this phase with about 3-4 minutes left on the timer. The big thing you have to watch out for is that a green circle may spawn right before this phase transition happens, forcing you to stand in it while the transition occurs. This can really screw over your team split. Your team may have to make an on the spot call on who will stay in the circle and who needs to go to their sector to get attuned. You absolutely need 2 condition damagers in the red sector and a boon stripper in the blue sector. Swiftness and superspeed can help you to make a last minute dash to the right sector.

Phase 5

Phase 5 is where most of the wipes happen as it is the most difficult. A single mistake can make the difference between a successful kill and a wipe. There are no new mechanics but several of the mechanics from Phase 1 and Phase 3 are modified to be more difficult.

Alternate Strategy (thanks to Aruthawolf)

There is an interesting strat for phase 5 which would remove lots of the RNG and make the last phase a bit easier. Basically, you do not stop the Vale Guardian’s Raidwide AoE which requires a breakbar (do not use any crowd control abilities at all). While the Vale Guardian is doing his AoE attack, he won’t do his green circle, red seeker orbs, or blue teleporting circles. Basically you position the boss in the middle and just attack him while switching between the sector AoEs.  You do have to watch out for the seekers orbs that spawn before he enter the breakbar phase as they will try to run towards the raid and deal massive damage.

Soft CC like slow/cripple/chill etc does eventually eat away breakbar and the green circle will spawn immediately after you breakbar him.

Sector AoE

Instead of having a single Sector covered in AoE, two sectors are covered in AoE. At start of the Phase 5 it will be Red sector that is safe while Green and Blue are covered in AoE. Tank will need to do the same thing they did in Phase 3 and drag the boss into the next sector about 3 seconds before the AoE sector change.

gw2-vale-guardian-guide-15

I cannot emphasize how important it is for the tank to move the Vale Guardian quickly into the next sector. We have countless 5-10% wipes because the boss weren’t moved fast enough either due to tank being slow or the breakbar not being removed within 1-2s. A green circle in an AoE sector in this phase will most likely cause a raid wipe.

Seeker Orbs

Unlike Phase 1 and Phase 3, 4 Seeker Orbs spawn in this phase, with the 4th one spawning in the middle. This makes seeker orb management much more important so use those knockbacks and immobilize to control them away from the green circles and the melee stack.

gw2-vale-guardian-guide-16

Personal Responsibility

Phase 5 is where basically where the real fight begins. All other phases were simply practice for this phase. You need to execute everything perfectly as even failing one will drastically increase the chance for your raid to wipe. This means avoiding the blue teleport circles, get into the circle on time, breakbar the boss quickly, and ensure the tank drag the Vale Guardian into the next sector in time. If someone gets downed in this phase, do not revive them unless they are along the path you are running through. Reviving a single player can cause 4-5 more players to get downed, result in a wipe.

Enrage and Downed State DPS

Enrage timer is at 8 minutes. After 8 minutes the Vale Guardian will do 200% more damage. It is still possible to kill the Vale Guardian even if you are past the enrage timer. Downed State DPS is also crucial so if the boss is low and everyone is downed, do not give up. There are tales of a single warrior getting up from Downed State with Vengeance and finished off the boss.

Acknowledgments

Special thanks to Lyralei, Meg, David, Arrow, Haru, Chu, Lumi, Rubik, Rx, Rayons, Pigee, Dani, Twana, Enko, Dan “Buy Riceballs” Daze and rest of [LOD] for their assistance with the raid and guide creation.

Archived Disqus comments

  • S

    Truffle Steak would probably be a better/an alternative option for food for Berserker PS war. With 2 Heralds, might stacking on a PS war is not as demanding so higher DPS can be brought via food. Bountiful is superior to superior sharpening stones though hands down – especially when running Truffle Steak.

    • rxsiu

      FWIW, for our specific run, the PS wars were the primary might pushers. The two heralds were focused on the DPS as much as possible.

      • S

        Yes – the PS wars are primary might pushers. But 2 DPS focused Heralds should have on Bountiful Sharp Stones and rotate through their F2 when in Glint, providing a substantial might upkeep even when they swap to Shiro. I’m saying DPS Heralds still allow PS Wars to go Truffle and the subgrps should still be capping 25 might with competent berserkers and Heralds.

  • Guest

    Thanks, Dulfy! Also, is there any chance you can post a guard tanking build/ guide like you’ve got for the dps?

  • zenight

    1st off thanks Dulfy for always providing us with guides for this game, with that out of the way.

    Wow, yeah I know I’ll be avoiding this content!

    Dang, ugly rewards and NiM SWTOR lvl mechanics…

  • guest

    Do you realise diferent compositions were able to kill this boss? “Guides” like these are a disservice to this game. Just Keeping the exclusory artificial elitism this game has been keeping for long with the dungeon speedruns.

    Sad the community of this game ends up making this game worse time by time…

    • Dulfy

      You do know that I did not say you must have a specific comp right? The specific classes I mentioned were because they bring something to the raid that others cannot. The comp is fairly flexible.

      • Weißer

        “In general the party composition is 1 Healer, 1 Tank, 1 Chronomancer, 1 Warrior, 2 Heralds, 3 Condition damage dealers, and fill the rest with whatever Power DPS”

        I think this passage is what guest is kinda talking about. Throughout the guide you make it sound a lot like this was “the” composition as in “meta” or “the only” composition.\ And this is something people have feared. That raids end up being a meta/elite thing that they wont have access to solely based on what class they play.

        There is no need to be so defensive Dulfy. You are doing a great job with your guides and we both know, that there are thousands of people appreciating your guides because GW2 has, after all, an extremely diverse playerbase.\ I can’t believe I am using this word, but I think your Guide could be a tad more inclusive and explain a bit better what is needed and why it is neeed before jumping directly to the group composition.\ This way you’d encourage people to try it rather than make them check the list and resignate because their specc/class is not listed there.

        (And if it turns out, that the raid is indeed only doable with a narrow group composition – so be it. But right now I think there is still a lot of room to experiment.)

        • Dulfy

          Once again, I mentioned that comp because they bring something unique. You need a tank,a healer. That is no brainer. You need a chronomancer because no other class can bring groupwide alacrity/quickness. You need a warrior because no other class have banners. You need 2 revenants because no other class have 50% groupwide boon duration and not to mention constant fury/might stacks. You need condition DPS for the red guardian.

          • Weißer

            I just don’t get your defensive attitude.\ This guide screams: “if you don’t fit the meta don’t bother reading past the first paragraph.”\ And you seem to completely misunderstand the constructive critique I provided.

            • Dulfy

              Well like raiding in other games, you want to min/max as much as possible. The comp I described is an optimal one. If you don’t want to run the optimal one, then run your own comp. It is a suggestion, not a requirement. You can still kill it without an optimal comp. You asked what is needed and why it is needed and what is exactly what I said in my previous comment.

              • Aruthawolf

                I would put warriors and revs in the Recommended category and explain why.\ Needed: Tank, Healer, Chrono (boon strip + alacrity), 2-3 Condi, 4-5 Power.\ Recommended: Warriors(banners, can be condi), Revs(if boonduration helps)

                With current tactics good options are:\ Tanks: Guardian, Warrior, Necro, Engi.\ Solo healing and tanking: Druid, Ele.\ Healers: Druid, Ele, (Guard and rev not optimal)\ Condition dealers: Engis, Warriors, Necros, Eles.\ Randoms for the rest of positions(recommended above)

                Green circle people: any non War, Rev, Mesmer or Guard(dps DH maybe)

              • SirMoogie

                You don’t even need chrono for boon strip. It’s one boon on a 10 second cooldown. Any DPS class with sigil of nullification can do it.

            • Requiem014

              If you don’t fit into the meta it’s not really going to work out. I saw guilds running full tank gear, and they couldn’t even get the boss to half health within the timer because they didn’t do enough damage. Their mechanics were great, but their gear didn’t allow them to put out the DPS required to defeat the boss in time.

    • lore

      It is just a guide, I am sure many different comps will be able to kill him- just some will be a lot easier to get a kill with than others…..

    • zenight

      Dude, it’s a guide, as in something to point you in the right direction based on what the person putting it forth knows (or feels) is true.

      It’s *not* God coming down from the Heavens telling you it’s 10 commandments, if you disagree you can voice that opinion but until you put a better one online for all to see you’re in no position to say any guide that works is a “disservice to the game”.

    • BobbyOrr

      Reading comprehension is not your friend.

    • Josef Tauser

      The “community” ? ArenaNet is a company, not a community.

  • Michał Lach

    Any chance for some specific raid builds for each character in team ?

    • Horus LEET

      Skill>Class just use whatever gets you through

  • Binny

    How do you know when the AOE sector will change? Is there some sort of visual indication or do you just have to keep track of time and be ready to switch every 20 seconds?

    • Dulfy

      Keep track of time mostly. If you have the boss on the intersection between two sectors you can drag him in.

  • :3

    Berserkers as in the elite specialization or the gear Berserker

    • Dulfy

      If you referring to our specific comp, it is 2 elite specializations

  • Rikil

    Hey Dulfy great work, are you planning on releasing the used builds for your group?

  • Hahahaha

    Delete your GW2 account if you can’t do Raid. No slot for Noob in this game

    • Yasin

      game will be dead if is that happen 😉

  • Alisar Dius

    Hi, please is it possible to include elementalist in the raid? It seems against the philosophy of arenanet that the supposed meta exclude some professions

    • Ulion

      Only thing I noticed is that their are few thieves and Necromancers in all of the first kills videos I have seen in raids. I am sure guilds will eventually try hard mode and do a raid with all one class. Stil I have seen guilds clear it wit a tempest tank, D/F berserker elementalist, and a ele healer.

    • Lyralei

      Tempests will see a lot of use on the second raid boss, Goreseval.

    • Requiem014

      Any class can run in the raid, Dulfy just posted what the most optimal group would be.

      • eleshazar

        She posted what *she thinks* is the most optimal group. Many people would disagree with her too. There are no numbers to back up her assertions. Most people think tempest or chrono make better tanks because of higher dps, and some of her other things in this guide are off (like runes of leadership…lol).

  • Kyaw Tun Lin

    Is the progress saved for raids? If you have defeated vale guardian, do you have to fight him again next raid in the same week?

    • Dulfy

      I believe progress is reset every week

      • Requiem014

        Progress resets on Sunday (regular reset time) unless Anet changed what was originally stated.

        And I believe you save from the Ley Portal (Or whatever it is called) at the entrance, once you have the mastery from it.

  • Sz

    World of Guild Wars?

  • GameGuard

    justa fyi you should edit your guiide somethign is wrong you state in it, during the split phase aka 2 and 4 you dont need 4 people at blue you can do it with 3 i do it all the time justa fyi, but duirng 1 and 3 and 5 you need 4 in the lighting aka green circles . just thouhg tyou should know

  • Ashton Llewellyn

    Hey, thanks for the guide! I know there’s been a few questions similar to this in the comments before me, but I was wondering if you had any ideas on what the tanks would use for armor. If I wanted to run a scrapper would I be fine to use berserkers gear as long as I had more toughness than the rest of my group? Or would I have to have more toughness than that in order to survive – and if so what armor/runes do you think would be best. Thanks again for the guide!

    • Dulfy

      Honestly I believe our tank run the barely minimum, just more toughness than the druid and put on some toughness runes like earth/forge runes and you will be fine. Vale Guardian doesn’t hit hard at all.

  • Bingolinha

    Im pretty shocked to see heals and tanks in this game. Since healing power stat have close to x0 in conversion rates to spells and thougness was almost a redundant stat in pve since you cant face tank anything really. And dont get the dodge debate thats why DMG is meta game.

    • Requiem014

      Heals and tanks are not quite required. Our Tank ran full berserker with (I think) 2 toughness rings. And our Healer was just a Druid in full berserker with a staff. If people are self aware, they can usually keep themselves alive!

  • Filippo Chinello

    ALTERNATIVE:\ Just wait 1 month for the “5min speedrun full zerk” guide

    • lore

      That is what I thought from the minute they announced raids. Successful raids require class/spec balance and this game has a long way to go in that department before they are ready for “fair” raids.

      • Filippo Chinello

        yep, looks like the wolf lose his hair but not his behavior, Anet is still Anet, even after HoT

        I can see people kicking half the classes out of raid groups just because they are not the best classes, now those people are rerolling Engi cond or Guardian healer / tank just to make raids and play 30mins in a week with that armor. lol\ that’s like spending 300gold on a new amror and weapon just to play a stupid dungeon

        • Requiem014

          Every single class can be useful in raid groups. It just depends on how you build and what your set up is. If you do 0 damage, you’re obviously not going to be useful at all. This is the same for dungeons and fractals.

          • Filippo Chinello

            Thanks captain obvious

            • Requiem014

              You’re the one who envisioned people being kicked based on class. I was just letting you know it wasn’t true.

              • guest

                we’ll talk in a few weeks. why would people behave any different in raids than in dungeons? just wait a few weeks longer and people will know what the best raid setup is. Then we are right back at dungeon community niveau in an isntant.

              • Gerald Tarrant

                Exactly right. I remember the same mentality in early dungeons. P3 CoF, for example, everyone shunned it except the intrepid group, and woe betides if you didn’t come sporting full zerk and a Guardian. Now? You can damn near run the thing with half a team outfitted in exotics.

              • nadrian3k

                It’s already happening 🙂

  • lore

    Kind of sad to see a game that bemouned the “holy trinity” going this route, sort of admitting defeat..

    • nadrian3k

      Not sort of but fully imo

    • Suz

      Except that’s a gross oversimplification of the mechanics. The first boss fight needs a tank, melee DPS needs to have CC, healer needs to DPS, ranged DPS is either DPS or condi, to say nothing of all the individual jobs on different phases. I’m hard pressed to think of as intricate an encounter in WoW. Most boil down to straightforward trinity and set rotations with the occasional gimmick. It’s a departure from what GW2 players are used to, but also WoW players…which may or may not be a good thing, depending on how challenging you want your content.

  • Majmo Mendez

    wow this looks kinda bad, glad I didn’t bother buying HoT

    • Thanks All

      It’s Anet’s evil plan to keep people stay inside the game. Raid is a giveaway for your \$99! LOL Thanks Anet. They never ever care those Asian guys. Who care those high-ping races?

    • Waffles_Of_Doom

      git someone to buy it for you!

  • Sergil

    I am rly interested in the build your Condition Engineers used.

    • Josef Tauser

      What build ? Engis’ only condition is burn stacks. Use abilities and traits that have the word “burn” “burning” or “condition” in the description.

      • Nick Rhodes

        And here you are again. The hate mongering is real.

    • Robert Robertul

      explosives 1(3),3,2\ firearms 1,1,3\ tools 2,1,1(2)

  • Alot

    Ouch. The last guild run I tried this in got phase 2 down by about the 9th minute. Phase one completion in 1-2 minutes is troubling -.-

  • Bananas

    Comment section is a bit cancerous, do you guys even play? It needs practice and coordination so if you got nothing good to say then better STFU.

    • Josef Tauser

      Take that free speech and freedom of expression ! In America we only say what they tell us.

      • Nick Rhodes

        Do all your comments have a tint of arrogance and insecurity, or is it just coincidence?

        • Josef Tauser

          Are you in love with me ?

          • Nick Rhodes

            It’s complicated.

            • Kitty_D

              NOW KISS.

    • Gerald Tarrant

      Practice and coordination. You hit the nail squarely on the head with that one, Bananas, and you are 100% correct. However, elitist pricks will have you believe that noone deserves to either practice or develop coordination unless they bring “BiS” gear and rock a meta build.

      Horse. Shit.

      Skill > Gear; Everyday, anyday. Yes, you do need a baseline gear distribution and yes, certain traits/skils are favorable. But, beyond this NOTHING is mandatory outside of skill. Just because one combination of professions, gear and skill hasn’t worked is absolutely no indication that it will not work at some time in the future with the right group of players with the patience to practice and develop the skills and coordination.

      Anyone gumming up map chat with ‘must have zealots,’ ‘zerk only,’ and ‘no thieves’ is clearly a shortsighted prick who somehow believes this content was introduced to satisfy their craving for speed runs.

  • Jaako

    Are there any special drops or just RNG again?

    • Dulfy

      I got crap drops (2 greens and an exotic) but others got ascended weapons and minis

    • Aruthawolf

      There are special drops but still on RNG tables, so most people only got random stuff.\ About 50% chance of getting ascended or a recipe or something relatively nice.\ And guaranteed legendary armor precursor collection unlock, so that is nice.

  • Aruthawolf Silverthorne

    Hey Dulfy there is a good tactic we used in a run today for phase 5, it doesn’t exactly make it easier just more manageable if you have a good healer.

    In phase 5 you can let the boss do his AOE cc aspect without breaking his break bar. During this he does not spawn any of the red, blue or green orbs so you can DPS freely only having to pay attention to the floor and if positioning is close enough to the middle then all dps can still hit him and if timing is right you will be able to skip 3 green orbs and do it in under 2 minutes.

    This is a link of the kill (yes we did it with only 9.5 people because of DC):\ \ PS. Like if you liked the super skilled healer 😀

    • Dulfy

      Thanks for sharing, it is a really interesting strat and would remove lots of the RNG that can happen in the last phase

      • dregsdakaballa

        this only applies to the last phase that 90%+ pug groups cant even get to anyway does that REALLY matter man lol

      • Aruthawolf (Florimel W)

        Happy to help, it is similar to the Tangled Depths Chalk idea, but it does require positioning attention to floor and skills that you are using and timing in CCing him out again after one full round of floor mechanics.\ We found that the Green Spheres were badly timed with the floor movements and the second or third one always spawned poorly in the bad floor section, or the tank died trying to move it early.

        PS. dreg, this one isn’t supposed to help you skip the whole fight just help you push though the last few % as that is where prepared guilds usually die, while pugs will feel extra frustrated if they can get to there but not finish the final push.

      • Rebecca Duarte

        Well that tactics apply to phase 3 AND 5 actually, whenever you get the break bar mechanics you can freely do that (keep it in mid, not break bar, watch for sector positioning \^\^). It’s counter intuitive but it’s much more manageable 🙂

  • dregsdakaballa

    WTF dulfy first decrepit nest screwup and now ur saying that the green aoe only spawns in same sector as boss but its ANY SECTOR THAT PLAYERS ARE IN WTF lol cmon guys what the fuck get it together 😀

    • Dulfy

      It is the same sector as the boss. If it spawn in a different sector it is because your tank moved him late.

    • Aruthawolf

      I do believe that that changed since beta 3, it did follow the boss always but maybe that is just because of better practice.

    • lore

      Calm down, it is a new raid and raids are new to the game- give it a week. Sometimes these things take a little time to figure out…

  • lore

    My guild has not tried this yet but for the people that have:

    Are “tanks” able to “hold aggro?” Is there some sort of “aggro table” or is it like the world bosses?

    Are “healers” healing all the time (during the fight)?

    I am just curious as to how this is working out.

    • Dulfy

      Aggro is based on toughness. Healer doesn’t really need to heal full time, they will have some opportunities to dps.

      • Retsurai

        druid have high toughness too u should add that they can also be tanks

      • Retsurai

        and can run on cleric

  • Jeremy Deats

    Love this game. Love, love, love GW2. Would love to see someone else take the lead designer position and give us a higher quality experience with next expansion.

  • Thetruthisntalwayspopular

    I found it boring as sin and a real chore. If this is what raids will be like, they can keep them. Ive already seen Guildies spend 4 hours doing this raid. When did GW2 turn into WOW? Fuck that.

    • lore

      Haven’t tried it yet so can’t comment on it but I do agree that raids seem somewhat out of place in GW2

    • Aruthawolf

      and yet a lot of people enjoy them.\ There is basically a big disclaimer outside the entrance saying\ “There is no reason for you to be here we will give you no rewards”\ so only play it if you enjoy perfecting your gameplay for hours, it is the only place in GW2 where you have to try, hope you find what you enjoy 😉

      • nadrian3k

        No rewards..yet legendary armor comes from there

      • Thetruthisntalwayspopular

        And that’s great. A lot of people “enjoy” one direction and Justin Bieber..So fucking what? It never ceases to amaze me how people take someones opinion as a personal slight.

        • KJ

          Not sure he took it as a personal slight, think he’s just saying that there’s part of the community that enjoys striving for perfection for hours… as for me, I’ll stick with One Direction, thank you very much!

      • Josef Tauser

        Why the serious fuck would anyone buy the expansion and not do a raid ? And is stepping in and out of coloured circles considered “perfecting your gameplay for hours” now ?

        • Nick Rhodes

          I like how you distilled movement, builds, preparation, team composition, fixed roles, skill level, and other environmental challenges to “Stepping in and out of colored circles.” Why bother living when life is just stepping in and out of colored circles? See what I did there, it’s called reductio ad absurdum, latin for argument to absurdity. That is what you are doing. A logical fallacy. A true representative of the freeing influence of the internet.

          • Josef Tauser

            “I like how you distilled movement, builds, preparation, team composition, fixed roles, skill level, and other environmental challenges…”

            That is the most meaningless start to a comment I’ve ever seen on this forum.

            “Movement”: You mean pressing W to go forward and S to move backward?\ “Preparation”: You mean a pee break before the raid ?\ “Team composition, fixed roles”” are the same thing. Even Dulfy and Anet state its not that important.\ “Skill level” is set by Anet to fit within the 14+ age group this game is targeted at.\ And “environmental challenges” means red and green circles.

            So am I right in stating that you’re a hopeless troll who reaffirms his idiocy to the world with each and every post ?

            And what is your point anyway ? Do you want people who bought the expansion to not try raids at all ? Or are you terrified of red and green circles ? Your beligerance is very confusing to me

            • KJ

              You heard it here, kids! As long as you can maneuver the circles and are age 14+, you can complete the raids! No other factors matter, like gear, positioning, group composition… god Nick, you’re such a troll to suggest that!!. As long as you remembered to pee before you started, you’ll be alright ;D

            • Nick Rhodes

              Should we add a *ding* noise for every reductio ad absurdums you make?

          • Gerald Tarrant

            Hmmm..guessing you must be a TTS lifer, Nick? Clearly, your attitude is part of the problem.

            • Nick Rhodes

              Assumptions of character really gives you the moral high-ground, doesnt it?

  • ross oogo

    thank you dulfy,,,, u know everyone follows ur guide blindly,,,, thanks to you now all i hear in pug or my guild is duly says no necro , duly says healer should be druid, dulfy says tank should be dragon hunter,,,,,no one wants, condi necro, no one wants burn ele, and tank mesmer,,,,,, thanks you, i know its not ur fault ui just can’t help it,,,,,

    • Lust

      I can see that happening 😉

    • nadrian3k

      You can partially blame ANet on forcing certain classes in a game advertised as not doing that.

      • Tank, Heal, DPS, Trinity, WoW

        Yeah they went 180 on that idea. It was pretty obvious after the Druid reveal.

        • Devon Lambert

          Honestly I don’t disagree with the decision to balance raids around having more of a pseudo comp. tank, healer, dps is the holy trinity for a reason. It allows developers to balance content so it’s more interesting. Would you prefer raids are just all zerkers who stack and burst stuff down in a matter of seconds? No…so the only way to destroy the zerker meta is to introduce pve content that necessitates other rolls. The meta for what comp works for raids although could become annoying, it is just dulfy saying “Hey here’s a comp we used that worked and seems that there’s some justification to it. Feel free to use it or do your own thing”

    • Ares Zax

      Yeah, I dislike the whole “meta or GTFO” attitude that’s ruling raids at the moment too (it’s why I never got into the GW1 endgame, because it was plagued with the same problem), but guild groups are usually more willing to experiment. Plus, give it time. It’s still early days, and people are still learning what works and what doesn’t. Super hard stuff like Tequatl and Triple Wurm used to fail all the time too when they first came out, and now they’re beaten extremely regularly.

      • Devon Lambert

        Definitely hated how Guild Wars turned into Meta Wars as it was concluding. Preferred to craft my own builds and even came up with a few that worked in vanquishing and elite missions. Then everything became speed-run-here’s-the-comp-or-fuck-off

        • Gerald Tarrant

          “Meta Wars.” Very well said indeed. I could care less about TT—-I mean elitist–morons who jam up map chat with their butthurt about meta. It simply means they lack both the skill and the patience to find other ways to win. Sure there’s a baseline of gear and skill with your class that’s needed. But they’ll insist their way and their party composition is the only way. Hell, they want to speed run raids like they do in zerk CoF, and it does not work that way. Unfortunately the weak willed player base buys into their nonsense all too quickly, having no opinions of their own to rely on.

          As the saying goes, “Bring the player not the gear.” Idiots simply can’t comprehend what this means, and so their incessant whining continues.

    • Robert Robertul

      there is no meta yet..many people run necro(not as condi though), ele(not as burn lol), and mesmer(as dps)..why would you wanna play with retards that copypaste dulfy who is like the ultimate casual anyway..

    • I lol’d

      Burn ele and a tank mesmer? And you blame dulfy that people don’t want those? I am sorry, that’s ridiculous. What’s next – a guy complaining that because of dulfy his healer thief got kicked out of a party?

      • MO

        its a distortion build for chronos, basically untouchable and lots of blocks in between. If you cant imagnien a mesmer tank then maybe you need to read up on a few things.

        • Sayo

          Chrono tanks are very viable. Not only do they have good utilities, but they give you the spot for one more dps dealer as well. It’s like getting 2 flies with one hit. If you can’t imagine one tanking it with all the evades, blocks and whatnots, you really don’t know Mesmer and should not comment about its viability.

      • Devon Lambert

        Yea…honestly…Chrono can have 4 blocks, sword evasion, shatter evasion, and their dodge rolls…then you jsut build toughness gear and I guess you could run the healing signet for 2 more blocks. Or mantras might work too for the extra toughness from constant channeling of mantra of pain for example…Not short blocks either by any measure…the shield ones last 2 1/4 seconds each and block all damage during that duration while the sword riposte and scepter block trigger once. I’ve never built or theory crafted the build but I can see Chrono being a great evasion tank.

  • eleshazar

    I really appreciate all of the work that you do Dulfy, but I’m going to have to disagree with you claiming this is the “optimal” class composition/builds. This is just how one guild did it.\ Background: I beat VG with a pug group with 1 minute still left on the clock.

    Personally I think that a tempest makes a better tank than DH. They can be tanky in cele and still deal decent dps. Chrono can still be heavy dps and doesn’t need runes of leadership. Necros can bring great power DPS to the group, especially with gravedigger no cd when low health, a staff tempest does just fine here DPS wise.

    Overall I think this guide only helps to fracture the community more. I really wish you would add a large disclaimer saying that this is just one way to do it. Or abstract from classes to what the roles are (which is really what is important). For reference my pug group with amazing dps was comprised of 2 herald, 2 tempests, 1 druid, 2 condi engis, 1 condi necro, 1 chrono, and 1 bezerker. We still had an entire minute left on the clock. This fight is much more about roles and knowing the mechanics than it is about which classes you bring. Sure, some are better than others at certain roles, but I definitely wouldn’t agree that this comp you are espousing is the best.

    Again, I really appreciate all the work you do, but I think this specific guide needs tweaking. It’s divisive, and also not accurate for “optimal”.

    • eleshazar

      Also the timing on the aoe dmg sectors is wrong in your guide. It is 12 seconds, not 20.

      • Dulfy

        No the timing on the damage sector is exactly 20s, not 12. Watch the video and count it yourself. The composition is merely a suggestion, not a requirement. While Chronos can do some burst dps, their role is giving the raid alacrity and quickness, which results in an overall bigger dps. Therefore runes of leadership are essential is recommended not just by myself by by chronomancers from various guilds who have cleared the raid. People wants to know a rough optimal composition and that is exactly what it is. If you don’t like it, don’t need to follow it.

        • eleshazar

          7:06-7:18 in p5 in your video. I did go back and watch the p3 aoe dmg areas and those appear to be 20 seconds. Maybe I’m miss counting, but p5 between 7:06 and 7:18 looks to be a 12 second duration.

          That aside, I have no problem with you offering one way of doing it. What I’m more miffed about is that you are proposing this as “THE” optimal composition which people less familiar with the game are taking as scripture. I’m not saying your composition isn’t viable by any means, I’m just saying that I disagree with you on some things especially who should be tanking.

          I just want to make sure that we emphasize the roles here as opposed to specific classes. Sure a thief would make a lousy tank, but I’ve seen a scrapper, a tempest, a DH, and a chrono all fulfill the role of tank here just as well as each other. I’d just be hesitant to say based off of one run with a guild, and talking to a few guilds what is optimal. You need a little more objective facts before you can declare that.

          • Dulfy

            Watch carefully, the aoe sector transition occurs at 7:01 and 7:21. Not 7:06 and 7:18. 7:01 is exactly when the previous sectors disappears and 7:21 is exactly when the next one shows up. There is a brief gap in between where no sector lits up.

            For the party composition, I am not sure if you are misreading that section or if you are nit-picking. Under tank I mentioned plenty of options – scrapper, dragonhunter, revenant, warrior. Chrono and Tempest tanks are also doing pretty well so I added them in as well. We used dragonhunter tank so I listed that as part of our composition. I am not sure where you are getting THE optimal composition, it is as generic as it gets.

            • Harold

              Guardian too, not only dragonhunter.

            • Novaan Verdiano

              Reapers make for good tanks at VG, not sure why you wouldn’t list them. They’re imo the best tanks right after Chronos.

  • Kidel

    Stop wanting heralds in full zerk. With warriir and ranger, plus double fury, we reach 120% crit rate. It’s a waste

    • Apple Foster

      This! Our guild runs Heralds in mixed gear for raids so they don’t have wasted stats.

  • Spaxx

    Thank you Dulfy !

    I have a question, where i can buy Zealot Trinkets plz ?

  • lMIKUl

    I cannot raid with my condi necro anymore…. people kept kicking me out to get condi engi -_- I know it’s not your fault… but now i gotta get condi full set for my engi as well….

    • Garm

      Condi necro is actually pretty strong. Definitely for the last 2 bosses, and its even alright for Vale Guard. Just most people can’t play around with them because most people don’t know how condi necros work. 🙁

  • Harold

    Dulfy you can jump to not get teleported by the Blue teleporting circles.

  • fresh1

    you really fucked over all of us necros here, because of hwo these idiots are following this word for fucking word

  • fresh1

    you really fucked over all of us necros here, because of how these idiots are following this word for word

  • Sinis

    Early successful raid groups had different setups like one friend of mine was in a raid that consisted of 4 Necro, 2 Ele, 1 Guardian, 2 Rangers and 1 Thief. Friend of mine was a Reaper tank (don’t know his build nor the rest of the individuals). They wiped a few times while figuring out on what the mechanics were but they got it done. Dunno on how the loot was as I didn’t ask but they did beat the raid with all bosses downed. They did it again this week and had no problems.

    Dulfy, I know you mean well but might be best to change up your guide on the class layout. Post to what role positions might be needed like how many condition, buff, tank, healer, etc., for the entire raid from start to finish. A similar guide to what SWTOR does like X tanks, X healers and X dps to where GW2:HoT needs like X tank, X healer, X dps, X condition damage? Its just a thought to consider :p

  • Doublemint Dave

    “Healer is usually Druid/Tempest in Zealot armor/weapon”

    Haha, yeah, no. I sincerely doubt that enough people can afford Zealot equipment to constitute the use of the word “usually”, unless you only meant it to refer to the class bit.

    • Dulfy

      Usually refers to the druid/tempest. Zealot stuff would be nice but a cheaper alternative can be Magi.

    • Apple Foster

      I mean every druid or tempest I’ve raided with who is running support, has done so in Zealot armor.

  • Gerald Tarrant

    It’s time for Arena Net to offer the olive branch to Blizzard, and ask for ideas on creating a Raid Finder; I mean, since they are clearly wanting to go the same direction with game mechanics as WoW, it only makes sense not to reinvent the wheel.

    • Aruthawolf

      Why the hell would they take WoWs looking for raid though, that thing doesn’t work nearly as well as the dungeon finder we have.\ I mean all we need is a few more categories added to the group finder and letting us invite to raid with a button and done.

    • Ash

      First of all, you should know that Blizzard did not invent the game mechanics they are using today. Actually, those mechanics have been borrowed from games such as GW2 which based the entire game around dodging mechanics rather than taking them to the face because you have lots of armor/health and abilities to reduce the incoming damage.

      Second of all. No, thank you. I don’t want that automated crap introduced into this game. With the automated crap LFG comes the ****heads whom think they should be able to clear content without putting in the effort. WoW can keep those “players”.

  • Alot

    I find the alternate approach for phase 5 very interesting. Can the raid wide aoe be reflected or projectile-destroyed? If you got your entire party to stack on a spot, attempt full protection up-time and spam AoE heals, would the squishier members of the group last through the bosses barrage?

    You’d still need to rotate around the boss but it would be an interesting approach to take…

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